Understanding the Business Side of Interior Design With Jessica Kelly

Welcome back to another episode of Bee-Spoke with Anthony Hellman! On this week’s segment of ‘Bee-Spoke with Experts’, Anthony invites guest Jessica Kelly on the podcast! Jessica is the owner of Jessica Kelly Designs, a full service interior design firm in Toronto with over 15 years of experience, committed to a thoughtful and individualized design philosophy. 

Listen in as Anthony and Jessica dive into her best advice surrounding the business aspect of the interior design industry, and taking advantage of opportunities to learn and experience as much as you can. A well rounded episode for new designers and the like, they also discuss approaching challenges and mistakes, the anxiety that can cause problems when working with difficult clients and a little bit of preferred colour trends for 2024!

Got a topic you’d like Anthony to cover on the podcast? Send your questions to our instagram at @Studio321B and be sure to check out Jessica Kelly Designs using the social links below!

Jessica’s Links:
Website
Instagram
Email: jessie@jessicakellydesign.com

Studio 321B Ltd Website • Instagram

Transcript

What's all the buzz about in the design industry? You'll find out so my name is Antonio home, and I am the founder and creative director of studio 321 be limited.

00:09

We're a Toronto based studio that designs and creates some of the most magnificent bespoke area rugs. Well, welcome to our new year's first episode of Be spoke with Jess Kelly from Jessica Kelly designs. Hello, Jess, how are you? Hi, thanks for having me. Delighted to be my pleasure to have you on our show on our podcast. So what inspired you to get into interior design?

00:38

So I have one of those stories where I was somewhat forced into it, I was working for an agency downtown, and I actually got fired. And I still remember calling up my mom and saying, you know, crying and saying, I just got fired, you know, what am I going to do? And she's like, Oh, well, that's easy. You'll just go back to school for design and do what you've always wanted to do, which is totally what I did. So I went to Sheridan and I studied interior decorating. And I started taking on clients when I was in school, and never worked for anyone else, which you could see as maybe, you know, not beneficiary, but also, you know, in the sense that I made my own mistakes and learned quickly from my own my own mistakes and sort of developed my own process. And yeah, started out with small spaces and condos and mail bachelor pads and have just evolved ever since.

01:33

Fantastic. I studied the Sheridan as well, when I was in grade school. It's amazing. I mean, my undergrad was something else but yeah. Right. And, you know, I love designing wreck. So it all paid off, it all worked out well. So how would you classify like your design style, like?

01:56

So we like to use the phrase contemporary with character. So we design you know, approachable, comfortable contemporary spaces, but what I like to stress is adding unique pieces, whether it's antiques, or architectural salvage or vintage, just anything that makes it feel, you know, as you would use the word bespoke anything that makes the space feel unique, but also personal.

02:26

Amazing. And yeah, I love your work. I mean, I follow you on Instagram, we work very closely with these.

02:34

We, you've been in business for a long time you want you appreciate your supplier, so I feel the same way.

02:41

Right back and telling. So but you know, for new designer coming into the industry, what advice would you give her like some of the young ones that are up and coming, you know, who are still studying at Sheridan and Ryerson and all the other famous places and OCAD

03:00

Yeah, you know, something that I regret, not learning more of when I started out was more of a business background, because honestly, so much of what you do, if you start your own business is the business side of it. And not just the fun design side of it. So much of it is project management. It's not, like I said, doing the creative, fun stuff all the time, it's the business side of it. And, you know, I came into it with a bit of a marketing background because that was what I was doing before I went into interior design. So that helped me a little bit and I did create a bit of a niche with, you know, I was known as the small space girl or the girl that could do the bachelor pads and that did, you know, that did help with my success at the time, there's obviously a cap to that, but I guess my My piece of advice would be like, get as much experience as you can, on the business side of things. So that you know, there is the restructure, take as many courses as you can. And now there's like so many great designers like, you know, can really sell them and Rebecca hay and offering, you know, these programs to designers to speak to pricing and contracts and investment guides and all those things, as many taking as many of those things as you can is very beneficial. But also, if you can figure out a way to niche to I think that's important because just like the real estate industry market in Toronto, the interior design industry is it is saturated with designers, there are a lot of designers that being said, I still think there's enough money in Toronto, I still think that there's enough for for the work to go around and you know if your work is good and and people like you then you know I think that the success will be there.

04:47

No and I agree I mean take as many lessons as you can we're finding that there's some components missing like we had a lunch and learn here yesterday was just amazing. And you know Some new up and coming designers are missing, like, color harmony, they don't understand enough about the products in the construction. And yeah, you know, I want you speak we spoke I mean, that's a whole different itself. Right? Yeah. So I'm wondering if you know, some more courses like that being offered in some of the learning facilities would be beneficial? What do you

05:26

know? Absolutely, I think so too. I think that, you know, composition and products. And, you know, if you're going to be dealing with high end clients, you need to know what your material makes makeups are and what your, you know, the composition of your countertops, and all of those things for you suggest them to the client, because if they turn around and come back to you, because something is broken down, well, that's if you're managing the project, then that's on you, you know, and that's, that's how we, that's what we do for clients, like, because we're managing the project, and we, you know, the our, our clients pay us a good fee to manage it. You know, we're also taking on that responsibility of fixing it when something goes wrong.

06:08

Risk management apps. Yeah, yeah, exactly. I understand. So, you know, you've done a lot of great projects, which ones probably one of your most memorable or which projects are most memorable?

06:23

Oh, it's so hard to say, you know, I mean, obviously, every designer wants a project where they can be involved from start to finish, where they have their hands on the initial architectural plans. And then it's the material selection, and also the decorating, we're currently working on a project, it is a bit of a dream project. Now it's not, it's not going to be finished probably until the end of the year. But it has all of those things involved. We started, we started probably three years ago, I think, in 2019, it has been a slower project. But that's kind of because the client has been enjoying taking her time, that's it hasn't been stressful in the sense that, you know, she's just happy where she is, it's her dream house. And it's been moving at a bit of a turtle's pace. But that being said, you know, we're doing all the material selection, we have a very healthy budget, and then we're moving on with all of the decorating. So I'm obviously very much looking forward to having it photographed. I think that too, with a project. It's not just necessarily what the design of it, but honestly, like when you've been in the business for a while the people are just as important because I have years where I deal with honestly nightmare clients that just like literally want to make you leave the industry. And then I have, you know, a project, like the project that I'm talking about. Now, it's the client like literally could not be lovelier, and it makes what you do so much more enjoyable. And I think that goes the same with your, you know, your suppliers and who you work with, when you can wake up and be like, Okay, I'm looking forward to tackling the day today, then that's, that makes it all worthwhile. Right?

08:02

I totally agree. I totally agree. It's all about connections, personalities, and horizontal relationships instead of vertical, where you're on the same page, and everything is going well, and you're communicating. Well. I mean, you know, one of my greatest challenges, I find that communication sometimes breaks down because someone has an idea in their head, and they're trying to convey it to us, and we're just not grasping it. Because, you know, we're speaking in different languages. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, you've you mentioned some challenges. So I'm sure we all go through challenges do you want to mention, like one of your challenges that you faced and how you resolve that, because that's pretty big. I mean, you know, we all we all go through challenges, and it's how we handle it, and, you know, which shows our character as a person, like, you know, we've messed up on rugs in the past, right? But we've just been by what we do, it's like, okay, we made the mistake, it's on us so we'll correct it right. Yeah.

08:55

And I think that that's the biggest thing I think to me when I look for a supplier or a trade or anything similar to how a client would look for me is like, as you say, we all do make mistakes and this is an industry where honestly, like who's kidding who there there is lots of room for error, but I think it's how you approach the error, how you make it better, you know, and if you care or not, and that is the biggest thing that I look for when I'm hiring a trade or looking for a supplier is is the amount of care you you have because if you make a mistake, you know, that's one thing we're gonna figure out a way to fix it but like if you care about fixing it, you know how much do you care about fixing it That to me is the biggest is the biggest factor and you know like I've I've made mistakes I've like I put a unit in for a client that she had removed the veneer and the back of the built in and and I forgot to tell the, the millworker that and I had to remove and pay for the whole new unit and it was just But this is, this is an example of the client that I was dealing with at the time was was not pleasant. And she made me extra anxious. And as like, as a result, I just wasn't doing my job properly, right. And I find that that happens with clients that give you anxiety or clients that aren't as nice, you know, it's just a comedy of errors, like I had that happen with, with another client recently that, you know, it was such a tiny project, and, you know, the communication just wasn't smooth and therefore, like, stuff happens, right? Whereas when you're, as you said, when you speak horizontally, and when you're on the same page, it's just like, you know, there, there's a harmonious sort of thing that happens that it just, you know, everyone's happy in the end.

10:49

No, and I agree with you. I mean, you know, what, if you have a pleasant client that you're working with, and understanding client, it is so much easier than, you know, you made this mistake, it's all on you, you're gonna pay for it, you know, and then it's gonna do for you. Yeah, you're second guessing yourself. Right?

11:05

Yeah. And I think it's just like making up for it. In the meantime, like, we had a, we had a supplier that, you know, didn't give me the right yardage for an ottoman and felt really badly about it. And he made her, you know, a temporary ottoman, so that she could have it for the holidays. And like, that's what you do when you care, right? Like he admitted that it was his mistake. And I think those kinds of things. So that means I'm like, for sure, I'm going to use you again. You know, you admitted that you are wrong, and you are making up for your mistake. And that's what I look for.

11:35

I'm totally with you. I mean, it's all about credibility, right? Yeah. So you know, long term relationships and protecting people. So color theory for this year, like what colors do you see coming up? What colors are you working with? Oh, I love coloring.

11:54

Because honestly, like there's been there was such a switch to like, to neutrals, the last couple of years, like you know, not not for lack of texture, but there was a lot of neutrals, whereas this year, I think you are going to see some more color like I always like using color. I think you're gonna go back again to like buttery yellows, and some like Cabernet colors. And you know, just Richard Hughes like I'm really into Farrow and ball's Studio Green right now, like any sort or like Seiji type greens, I'm really into, again, like nothing, that they're still rich and deep colors, but in the way of neutrals, almost two cents, like you're not seeing fuchsias or, like, you know, vibrant oranges, I don't think but those really deep hues, you're gonna see a huge return. I think I've been seeing that. And I'm excited for that. I'm

12:51

excited as well. I mean, I'm so tired of gray and beige. And yeah,

12:55

we should I love that creams are back and yellows are back. And you know, the Yeah, no more gray.

13:03

No, they're soothing colors. I mean, like, you know, what a space is a space and it's how you feel in that space. Like I think, you know, since we've been living in green, beige, we've all like kind of phased out. It's like, Whoa, I mean, I love color. Okay. Color Elysee happy. Yeah. I've gone to some projects. And it's like, oh, yeah, okay, we're doing this again. Okay, great. Yeah. Like, you know, but now I'm glad that those colors are coming, especially the greens. They're just so serene. I'm

13:33

loving greens right now. Yeah.

13:36

So you know, in closing, just give us a little bit of information about yourself, your company, you know, the kind of clients that you work with? And of course, like, you know, your email address, because there's more than designers watching our podcast. So we're here to support you. Absolutely.

13:54

Yeah, no, I appreciate that. So we've been in business for, I always think, feel like, I'm so old when I say this, but over 15 years now, we have an office located in varla, and gymnasts area. I have a team of two to three other staff depending on how busy we are. So we have an associate designer and then an operations manager and then another senior designer. My associate looks after all of our drawings, and she will often help me with sourcing and also management and then my operations manager is involved in all of our invoicing, but also the procurement of all of our executing all of our purchases. So our process works such that we work on three phases. So initial consultation, and then after that consultation where we get a sense of the scope of work and the project we put together a design agreement with the scope of work and it also includes the price the fixed fee price for our the design phase of the project. So we do, quote, fixed fee. I've been in the industry for a long time now. And I just find that giving clients an opportunity to budget for designer is so much more beneficial. I just find that when you know what the price is going to be upfront than it, like I said, allows you to budget for a designer and there's transparency there. And then our management phase is priced as a percentage of the budget. So anything under 100k is 20%. And then once you go over that, then it drops down to 18. It's a sliding scale. Our management, like I said is, you know, you talked about risk management. It's a huge part of our business, managing the trades, managing the purchases, deliveries, site checks, all of those things that it allows us to really look after everything for our clients and take all of the guesswork out of specifically large projects, but also small projects too. So we work on anything from you know, one room redesign to, you know, we'll get jobs, renovations and new builds as well.

16:08

So fantastic. And your email, contact information.

16:14

Email is Jessie je SS vi e at Jessica Kelly design.com. And then our Instagram is at Jessica Kelly design and our website which has actually just been recently updated. So definitely check that out is Jessica Kelly design.com.

16:32

Fantastic. And last question before closing what's little Virginia taking over the company?

16:38

Oh, geez. Yeah, I have a three and a half year old daughter and her it's so funny because her daycare teacher told me today she's like, she is my strongest person in my in this class. She's like, she is going to be such a leader. And it's funny, like, I consider myself you know, a little bit shy and I've never been, you know, a total extroverted person and it's funny when we you know, like this offspring that is so completely different than ourselves. So, yes, you just wait you might be running my companies.

17:15

Love to work with these. Thank you, Justin, thank you for taking the time. So thank

17:20

you so much for including me and we love working with you and appreciate everything you do for us. So

17:26

same, totally the same. You're just magical. I love working with you.

17:31

Appreciate that.